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The Data Port - Politics, Literature, And The Little Disturbances of Man

WikiLeaks and the Afghan War

by on Jul. 30, 2010, under Politics

It’s been five days since WikiLeaks released the raw intelligence data about the Afghan war.

If you are a true political junky you have probably devoured the reportage by The NY Times, The Guardian and Der Spiegel.

If you’ve missed any of it I suggest you visit those sites and get caught up. Links below.

There are two questions that can be asked about this huge data dump: Has it done any harm and does it tell us anything about the progress of the war that we (as citizens here at home) didn’t already know?

Let’s talk about the possible damage. On this issue Don Smith, over at Fort Buckley, makes an excellent point. The data dumps revealed the names of numerous Afghan informants upon whom our forces relied. Those informants were ordinary Afghanis and not part of the Afghan government infrastructure…army, police, political officials.

They have now been put in harm’s way and, worse, their reasonable expectation of confidentiality has been damaged…with the result that informants will be less likely to come forward in the future.

It’s argued by some that another source of damage is the fact that these reports reveal something about the response tactics of our forces; something that the Taliban somehow didn’t know. It’s not clear to me that this could be true, since the Taliban have been on the receiving end of those tactics and they’re not dummies.

So what do we at home know that’s new, really new? Not much, with the possible exception of the fact that the enemy now has heat-seeking missiles with which to bring down helicopters. I imagine they’re a bit more sophisticated than the weapons we gave the Mujahidin with which to torment the Russian bear.

For the rest of it, all the leaks do is confirm what we might already have assumed from news reports:

The Taliban are skilled guerilla fighters, whose mobility allows them to offset some of the advantages of heavily mechanized armies. Like all guerilla forces they have the advantage of invisibility, able to melt into the population, like fish in the ocean.

The Afghanis have apparently no real sense of “Nationhood.” Afghanistan is essentially a collection of tribal fiefdoms in which corruption (or what we call corruption) is simply what they treat as common business practice. It is so commonplace that it became fodder for an American comic strip. Trudeau (Doonesbury) spent a week describing an Afghan commander and his soldiers systematically disassembling an army post and selling it off piecemeal.

Civilian deaths do us no good, and there have been a number of them. I believe that we have made every effort to avoid them. However, in the fog of war, especially in the sort of guerilla war that is Afghanistan, face this fact: These deaths are tragic, but unavoidable.

To the extent that we, as American citizens, continue to support this war, or fail to oppose it, the responsibility for those deaths is yours and mine.

Finally, something we knew but didn’t want to face: It is cheaper for the Taliban to fight us than it is for us to fight them. The latest supplemental war funding bill was a shade less than 59 billion dollars. That’s 59,000 million dollars. Since we are planning to send 30,000 more troops to Afghanistan that figures to almost 2 million dollars a soldier.

Perhaps it’s time for us, as citizens, as voters, to discuss what we really want to do about this war. Nine years is a long time; 1215 deaths and 6773 casualties is a high cost in human suffering; 90 billion dollars (Heritage Foundation estimate through 2010) is a lot of money.

Does the present state of the Afghan war represent success or failure? Ultimately it’s our call.

Here are some links:

Der Spiegel

The Guardian

NY Times

Fort Buckley

Cross posted to: http://thedataport.blogspot.com



  • http://nuclearsupremacyforindiaoverus.blogspot.com Satish Chandra

    I am India’s expert in strategic defence and the father of India’s strategic program, including the Integrated Guided Missiles Development Program. I have shown in my blog titled ‘Nuclear Supremacy For India Over U.S.’, which can be found by a Google search with the title, that all terrorism and insurgencies in the Indian subcontinent and in much of the rest of the world is sponsored by the C.I.A. Both Pakistan’s ISI and India’s RAW (Research and Analysis Wing) function as branches of the C.I.A. and participate in terrorism and insurgencies throughout the Subcontinent, under direction of the C.I.A. Yes, the ISI secretly supports the Taliban but it does so under direction from the C.I.A. whose modus operandi is support for ALL sides of a conflict to control the course of the conflict in service of its own goals. The goal of the U.S. invasion and occupation of Afghanistan and partial occupation of Pakistan is eventual occupation and overt colonial rule over the Subcontinent as a whole. This will not be permitted and all those participating in this enterprise, including the U.K., will be duly punished; see my blog. The document leak currently in the news has been made in preparation for abandonment of this goal and withdrawal from Afghanistan because of steps I have already taken for the nuclear destruction of New Delhi and then the coast-to-coast destruction of the United States by India with 5,000 thermonuclear warheads and extermination of its population; see my blog.
    The above blog answers all questions. The author’s biography can be found in Marquis’ Who’s Who in the World (2010 and earlier editions).

  • dataport

    Whoa. I am inclined to take this comment down because, frankly, it strikes me as quite mad.
    On the other hand, I’ll leave it up for a couple of hours to give people  chance to comment on it.
    Imagine that you are an intelligence officer. How much weight would you put on this “raw data?”
     

  • Don

    Excellent, and thought-provoking. 

  • http://pointmantucson.yuku.com/ mike_brewer

    “Everything that’s old is new again.” Not unlike when we invited Ho Chi Minh to study at Harvard. Some of us have not lost our institutional memory.

  • http://www.newerahatss.com New Era Hats

    Nice list. Like seeing some new places listed.

  • Don

    DataPort, sorry for the tardy reply—it’s been a busy week.  I wanted to take some time before I gave you (and the readers) my answer to the questions below:

    Perhaps it’s time for us, as citizens, as voters, to discuss what we really want to do about this war.

    There is value in keeping Afghanistan from becoming a terror base again.  There’s also value in keeping an American presence in Afghanistan, as it gives us a base from which we can watch, and perhaps influence, events in Pakistan and Iran.  If the mullahs eventually fall from power in Iran, and if the radical Islamists can be kept from getting control of Pakistan—and its nukes—-the world will be a much safer place.

    DataPort is right about the nature of Afghan society; it won’t ever be Mayberry RFD.  (At least in our lifetimes).  It’s not Iraq, which has an educated populace and a history of connection with the West.  Any attempts to “Westernize” Afghanistan will almost assuredly come up short, if not fail altogether.

    However, it’s important we not abandon the Afghan people.  Many in the world would interpret that as a sign that America is cutting-and-running.  To some (e.g., terrorists),  they’ll take that as a sign of American weaknesses; that might lead them to believe that it’s worth trying to attack us again.  Oh, we’ll probably beat back such attacks, or at least absorb them.  But, we’ll take casualties in the process.  The best bet is to keep your enemies off-balance and intimidated, so they don’t attack in the first place.

    Also, there’s an appeal to our humanity as a nation, and as a people.  The Taliban are brutes.  DataPort is right, in that we owe a lot to the Afghan people now.  Should we simply consign them to the tender mercies of the Taliban again.  I agree that we may lack the resources to safeguard the whole country—but what about the major population centers, like Kabul?  At the very least, we can provide places where Afghans can escape to, if they want to escape the Taliban’s clutches.

    Right now, General David Petraeus is assessing what’s possible in Afghanistan.  His track record in Iraq should inspire a lot of confidence in his judgement on counterinsurgencies.  Let’s hear what Petraeus has to say. 

  • leftfield

    I would love to reply to Don’s point, but my personal war with the reCaptcha is going about as well as the war in the Middle East.  I am getting very tired of typing long, thought-out responses only to have them disappear because the captcha is unreadable.

    • tiponeill

      Battle tactics
      1) Always do a “copy” before hitting go.
      Usually if it fails, the Browser back arrow will restore your text, but if not you have a copy.
      2) If u aren’t sure what the screwy text says, hit the little “recycle” symbol (above the “speaker” symbol) and it will offer you different text. I iften have to re-cycle a few times before I see something I can read.
       

    • Don

      Left, I threw in the towel long ago; reCaptcha has beaten me.  I always copy any lengthy comment into a Word document, just in case.

  • http://tucsoncitizen.com/dataport Art Jacobson

    Hey, Left…
    Please try again.

  • leftfield

    OK, with a little help from my friends I’m going to try again. 

    Don, it seems to me you are making three points in support of a US military presence in Afghanistan: first, that this will reduce the danger of an attack on US soil; second, that it allows for greater influence over events in the Middle East vis a vis Iran and Pakistan; finally, that the human rights situation in Afghanistan will get worse in the absence of US occupation.  

    My impression has long been that the attacks have been motivated in the first place by the presence of Western culture and, more importantly, Western troops in the Middle East.  I think staying there is only going to create greater resentment and more attacks.  

    As to the issue of human rights, I agree that a Taliban takeover would be a bad thing for most Afghanis.  But I haven’t seen the Taliban get smaller or less committed in our time there.  How long before we see “the light at the end of the tunnel”?  You should know better than me the conventional wisdom that you can’t kill and capture your way out of an insurgency.  One has to erode the popular support for the insurgency.  What with the civilian deaths and the complete failure of the attempts to provide services and protection to the people, what makes you think this is still possible?  With no effective government, the people have to pick one side or the other to run to for protection from both sides.  I think most Afghanis know that the US will leave them hanging just like it did the Iraqis.  Besides that, it is just so silly for the US to get all high and mighty about saving people from this or that and bringing the light of democracy to the savages.  Most people know their history a too well to believe that.  Agent Orange - a real humanitarian gesture.  The gift that keeps on giving.   

    If you want to “win” in Afghanistan, follow the succesful strategy of the US in Vietnam: bring the troops home and send McDonald’s over.     

    • leftfield

      P.S. my reply is entirely within the context of bourgeois democracy.  I include no reference to a socialist analysis of the invasion.  Just for you, Don.

    • Don

      Leftfield, thanks for the thoughtful and challenging response.  Not only do I have to put on my thinking cap, I have to cinch the chinstrap tightly!  Thanks also for your patience in waiting for my reply.  I’m on a business trip.

      I agree that many Afghanis will be upset by a Western presence, some of them enough to become violent.  However, I think there’s also a chance that the Afghanis—especially in the cities—-will remember how harsh the Taliban was.  I still think there’s time to win enough hearts and minds in those places to make a difference.  As for the remote hinterlands—sadly, those might be lost causes. 

      I think most Afghanis know that the US will leave them hanging just like it did the Iraqis. 

      Actually, the US didn’t leave the Iraqis hanging.  We stayed over there, surged our forces and salvaged—I’m sure we’ll disagree here—a victory.  (Not a complete victory, as we achieved over the Germans and Japanese, but a victory nonethless).  Moreover, we won’t be “leaving” Iraq for a long time.

      Recent history has shown that, when US troops stay around, (e.g., Germany, Korea), continents tend to stay quieter than they have in the past.

      Plus, the Afghanis are pragmatic enough to recognize that, as I mentioned above, there’s value in a long-term American presence in this country.  A presence with a smaller footprint, to be sure—but still a presence.  Value for us, and value for them. 

      So, I don’t agree that the Afghanis “know that the US will leave them hanging.”  We could be around there for a very long time.  And, while we’re there, we can do a lot to help suppress the Taliban.  That should make life for Afghanis—especially Afghani women—much better.

      • leftfield

        Actually, the US didn’t leave the Iraqis hanging. 

        I didn’t clarify that I was referring to the first invasion and the subsequent aftermath.

  • http://pointmantucson.yuku.com/ mike_brewer

    The most curious aspect of the entire Afghanistan theater is that our major thrust is in the direction of land distribution and empowerment of an illiterate peasant class.  Decree 8 of the land reform is all about redistribution of land. The very thing that the Fort Buckley et al, would abhor if it were happening in Sierra Vista, Arizona. Of the 22% of arable land only .08% can be farmed because of the lack of irrigation. The rest of the land is not efficiently cultivable. With nearly 50% of the population being landless farmers, who do you thing they will be beholden to?  Once we isolated Islamic factions, nationalism and modernization,which is considered to be pro-imperialist, what nucleus is there to work from?  The only core of cohesion is communal and religious values, all of which are adversarial to our ways.  How can you win the heart and minds of a people who have no center and no economic juice. At least Ho Chi Minh had loyal working  and productive farmers.  The only possible way of prevailing in this ancient land is by mocking a Marxist  philosophy. Mind you I said mocking not adhering, which of course would telegraph our motives and put us a track to hell.  I trust Petraeus, and will pray for him. In the interim I  will just  watch “Rubicon” on AMC to see what transpires.

    • Don

      I wholeheartedly agree with Mike Brewer, who apparently thinks he can read minds, when he says:

      The very thing that the Fort Buckley et al, would abhor if it were happening in Sierra Vista, Arizona.

      I would abhor the redistribution of land in Sierra Vista, or anywhere in Arizona or the US, for that matter.  Of course, the populace of Sierra Vista isn’t an “illiterate peasant class.”  It doesn’t need some benevolent uber-force to look out for it.

      The only possible way of prevailing in this ancient land is by mocking a Marxist  philosophy. Mind you I said mocking not adhering, which of course would telegraph our motives and put us a track to hell. 

      Okay—does anyone know what Mike is talking about here?

      I trust Petraeus, and will pray for him.

      Ich auch!

  • erniemccray

    Does anyone dare mention that both our wars in Afghanistan and Iraq are “illegal,” a term that fills many spaces on this website? And what is it about what’s happened in Iraq that spells v-i-c-t-o-r-y? The country was practically decimated in Desert Storm and the “Shock and Awe” show ripped the country “a new one” even more so. People still die there everyday due to such displays.
    And to add fuel to the fire, many of us in the U.S. are screaming murder regarding the possibility of a mosque being built at Ground Zero – which gives credence to what bogey men like Osama and the like say about us, that we hate Islam, that we are their staunch enemy. Such were the themes behind the madness of 9-11-01. Such are the ingredients of a jihadist recruiter’s dreams of making his quota. People seeking multitudes of virgins in an after world are signing up by the score as I type.
    Add drones killing children in Pakistan and we get nowhere near doing anything that will solve anything in the Middle East.
    Pat Tillman?… Our teenagers are being recruited by the Pentagon every day on their high school campuses, having been told that they will “make a difference,” and without a whimper we watch them go to another world and die.
    The question remains viable: “War! Humm! Good God! What is it good for? Absolutely nothing!”

    • Don

      Does anyone dare mention that both our wars in Afghanistan and Iraq are “illegal,”

      Sigh.  Congress has endorsed the American missions in both Iraq and Afghanistan.   Whose approval do you think we should seek?

      War! Humm! Good God! What is it good for? Absolutely nothing!

      Well, without war, we might not have ended slavery in this country, and Nazi Germany would still rule Europe. 

      And what is it about what’s happened in Iraq that spells v-i-c-t-o-r-y?

      Oh…the fact that a despot has been removed from power, and millions of people can now try to build a peaceful government, and govern themselves in ways that won’t threaten their neighbors.

      Ernie, this is one first-class rant here.  Were you smashing your skull against the wall as you typed this?

      • Mike Brewer

        Who’s  your Daddy? The one blocks comments in his own play-pen?

  • http://pointmantucson.yuku.com/ mike_brewer

    “Congress has endorsed” are the  operative words there. That is not a Declaration of War.
    Ding dong the Dictator is gone. Damn good thing. The irony being that he kept the real bad guys, Iran,(our former pals, who trained pilots at DM), down in the cellar. Now this nubile Iraq security force has a real mans job. It is they, and our State Department, along with some private contractors with guns, who have to take center stage. There are many decades of acts left in this play.  I think General Jones, the former Commandant of the Marine Corps and his NSA staff, quiet as they may be, are doing a helluva a job. I hope our sick political polarized citizens state side, know how to support them, or we will be back there in a heartbeat…..Iran that is!

  • http://www.militarydater.com Peg Bellefleur

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